I have found that Paul Roark on black and white digital printing to be very helpful, and am using his infromation .Paul is the best. I worked with him and MIS as the first beta tester of the inkset on a wide format printer. I can't tell you how many times I filled, purged and refilled that 7600. I developed a lot of the early curves for the UT7. Still have them if anyone has an interest. It was an arduous process... and in the end, I have all but abandoned it for the digineg->platinum process.

Bill

Jim

Really georgeous images, I think I will be proceeding in a colour gum over platinum, but wow, really nice stuff.


I've done it this way Bob abnd it works very well. Problem is there is still the metamerism. I get color shift under different lighting conditions... even with the platinum overcoat. This drives me crazy and prevents me from doing much more with the process.

Bill

Jim
Really georgeous images, I think I will be proceeding in a colour gum over platinum, but wow, really nice stuff.

I have to agree with Bob. Jim's images look amazing. Platinum over inkjet, I wouldn't have even thought it possible... I bet they look even better in "real life".

I have to agree with Bob. Jim's images look amazing. Platinum over inkjet, I wouldn't have even thought it possible... I bet they look even better in "real life".They do, at least the ones I've seen.

Don Bryant

They do, at least the ones I've seen.They are really beautiful Jim. They are really fun to do as well. That "instant" gratification is nice to have in this case as opposed to the gumover process. Check out some of the ones Burkholder has done as well.

B

I talked to Kerik Kouklis during a day at Alcatraz, and am now interested in trying out the gum over platinum. Most of my Pt over pigment images tend to have a single dominant color, so that should work nicely with that process. I think i'll invest in one of his workshops soon.

and thanks for the feedback. very much appreciated

jim


They are really beautiful Jim. They are really fun to do as well. That "instant" gratification is nice to have in this case as opposed to the gumover process. Check out some of the ones Burkholder has done as well.

B

What print methods do you all use for hybrid work?

I have three inkjet printers - a colour 2200 that uses normal Ultrachrome inks from the 4000, a B&W 2200 driven by IJC/OPM that uses K3 inks from the 4800 with diluted R800 blue and Krystal Topkote, and an R800 for run-of-the-mill stuff. I also get stuff printed onto Fuji CA. I'll probably swap the colour 2200 for a 3800 when it comes out.

Best,
Helen
I'm surprised no one has mentioned QTR in this thread. I've had very good results with making monochrome inkjet prints with my 2200 though I don't make very many of them.

I've been very pleased with the panoramic images printed on 19x38 sheets of Red River Polar Matt. I opt for a warm sepia toned look as the neutral tone doesn't appeal to me.

I've also use Inkjet Art's Micro Ceramic Luster paper, a much less expensive clone of Epson Luster. It has some bronzing from the gloss differential but that is eliminated with two light coats Premeir Art spray. I've left a large print hanging in my window for over a year with no fading and best of all I see no matamerism.

In the past I've used the Cone Head and MIS quads (FSN) with my old 1160 using the Piezio driver and the old John Wolfe curve. When the printer heads didn't clog or cause banding pretty good results could be expected.

I've now seen prints made with Epson 7600s using Epson Ultrachrome inks on the new Museo Silver Rag paper and I was really impressed. The Cone k7 inks printed on the new Hannahmuhle <sp?> paper really are beautiful for a matt surface print.

Epson 2200 on Photowarehouse OHP. Right now I'm working on a number of tri-color gum images.

I'm really tempted to try the gum over pigment also... Jim, what paper are you using? I'm wondering if I could just run Fabriano Artistico EW straight through my printer....

i use COT 320. Since i use Ziatype, my Pt/Pd images are almost dead neutral, the COT320 isn't neutral.. but it's the closest i've been able to find.



Epson 2200 on Photowarehouse OHP. Right now I'm working on a number of tri-color gum images.

I'm really tempted to try the gum over pigment also... Jim, what paper are you using? I'm wondering if I could just run Fabriano Artistico EW straight through my printer....

Jim

We are planing a workshop with Mark Nelson and Sandy King on Precision Negatives to Platinum Prints. I have been in communication with Kerik and plan to bring him here to Toronto to do a workshop mid winter.
As you will find out I have a Lambda exposing unit that we are planning to make up to 30x40 inch FP4 film enlarged negatives for the platinum process.
Take this thinking a bit farther.
Imagine a film negative spec to platinum process, then three separation negatives in register all produced from the same colour file,
This is my thinking for colour gum over platinium and by having Sandy, Mark and Kerik spend time at my lab I think it is totally possible workflow.
I have done a lot of registration work in my past and I think the colour permanent image over a platinum base would be a wicked combination.

Couple of questions. How did you register the platinum neg to the epson output. I am assuming that these images are larger than the original image.
Did you size the inkjet paper before printing , after printing or both?
Have you considered gelatin coating the final composite?

If these ques give away your secrets I will understand you not delving into them, but I am assuming that these will be some of the things I will be doing once I start this process.




I talked to Kerik Kouklis during a day at Alcatraz, and am now interested in trying out the gum over platinum. Most of my Pt over pigment images tend to have a single dominant color, so that should work nicely with that process. I think i'll invest in one of his workshops soon.

and thanks for the feedback. very much appreciated

jim

I'm surprised no one has mentioned QTR in this thread. I've had very good results with making monochrome inkjet prints with my 2200 though I don't make very many of them.
...

IJC/OPM is similar to QTR. I first used it with the original Cone inks (which became 'Septones') and now use it with my modified K3 B&W ink set in a 2200.

Best,
Helen

...my modified K3 B&W ink set in a 2200.If you don't mind my asking Helen, what is the modification?

Bill

Cool stuff! Bob - I am looking forward to working with you in Toronto. Keep me posted... My dance card is filling up for 2007.

As far as the inkjet/platinum combination, Dan B. lays down the ink first, then prints pt/pd over that using registration marks to align the images. Getting ink to land in registration over the pt/pd seems nearly impossible... I've played with this some, too, but I really prefer the gumover look as well as the work flow.

Jim - nice meeting you at Alcatraz. What a cool place that is! I'm working on a few digital negs from the shoot and hope to have some gumovers done soon.

If you don't mind my asking Helen, what is the modification?


The current version is:

MK, PK, LK, LLK, LC, LB, Krystal Topkote.

The MK is the same for UC and K3, of course, and the LB is made from R800 blue diluted 1+4 with MIS base. Using greater amounts of dilute ink gives less dottiness than small amounts of dense ink. All the rest are straight K3 inks from the 4800, apart from the Krystal Topkote which is a clear glaze. On glossy paper it increases DMax and the near-DMax densities, thus increasing separation of shadow details. I tested a number of different combinations to arrive at that set of seven, including tests of further dilutions of LLK.

The beauty of IJC/OPM and QTR is that you can put any ink or other suitable fluid in any position and control exactly how much of it is laid down for any pixel value. You can also make inverted profiles to print a negative directly from a positive.

Best,
Helen

i use COT 320. Since i use Ziatype, my Pt/Pd images are almost dead neutral, the COT320 isn't neutral.. but it's the closest i've been able to find.

Thanks, Jim, I've got a package of 11x14 cot320 so I'll try using that. I can use room temp potOx and get pretty close to neutral blacks. Would you mind sharing more of your workflow with me? I'm really interested in this and think this would work much better for a group of prints I need to have finished by this Thursday :-/

Finally, love the betterlight stuff and now that I shoot with one on a regular basis I can't imagine how you carted one around where you did. Have you ever shot w/ the pano head? I'll be using it again tomorrow for some fun shots of an exhibition that needs posters.

Thanks, Jim, I've got a package of 11x14 cot320 so I'll try using that. I can use room temp potOx and get pretty close to neutral blacks. Would you mind sharing more of your workflow with me? I'm really interested in this and think this would work much better for a group of prints I need to have finished by this Thursday :-/

Finally, love the betterlight stuff and now that I shoot with one on a regular basis I can't imagine how you carted one around where you did. Have you ever shot w/ the pano head? I'll be using it again tomorrow for some fun shots of an exhibition that needs posters.

i've printed two ways with the pig/pt. with white borders, and with brushed borders. The brushed is the easiest way to cover any registration issues. The place you'll most likely see that is on the outside edge of the image. Even though you use the built in registration marks from Photoshop, if the paper is at a different humidity level when you print the inkjet and when you expose the platinum. I normally pre-humidify the paper before putting it through the printer.. trying to get it to a similar feel as when i print the Pt.

If you have any specific questions, please ask

As far as the Betterlight goes.. i love using it in the field. i like the quality of the image.. and yes.. i own the pano adapter.. took that to Ankor as well :)

http://www.jcollum.com/fm/pano3.jpg

jim

Jim, sorry to pester you with questions, but I have another. I was thinking of doing a CMYK conversion and dropping out the black layer to give me what I should print with the inkjet. Do you have any suggestions on this front? I figure you may have some insights which could save me time, paper, and ink.

Jim, sorry to pester you with questions, but I have another. I was thinking of doing a CMYK conversion and dropping out the black layer to give me what I should print with the inkjet. Do you have any suggestions on this front? I figure you may have some insights which could save me time, paper, and ink.

not pestering at all. I find the CMYK conversion is the easiest i've used. you need to make sure, though, that the conversion setup is right.
1. under edit, Color Setting, select Custom CMYK working space.
2. speration type should be eGCR and black generation set to maximumj

save this as a custom (i call mine ziatype)



i end up with two files, the negative and the color.

to get the color
1. convert cmyk (make sure current cmyk working space is the one created above.
2. go to channels and select the K layer, then ctl-a (select all)
3. delete, and the K channel should turn white. when you click on CMYK now, you should have a faint color image, with no detail information.
4. convert that to RGB and then make curve adjustments as necessary for color intensity.


negative
1. convert to cmyk (same as above)
2. go to channels, select K
3. convert to grey scale
4. convert to rgb

from here, you'll need to have some inversion and curve layers that have been created for your working env (paper, chemisry, ink). I'd be happy to share mine with you as a starting point, but they are specific to the Epson ultrachrome inkset.

jim

Thanks again, Jim! I've got curves for producing the palladium layer though I don't have one for the color... but I guess that's just a matter of doing one and deciding if I need more or less intense color.

Thanks again, Jim! I've got curves for producing the palladium layer though I don't have one for the color... but I guess that's just a matter of doing one and deciding if I need more or less intense color.

yea. the color curve is going to be image dependent. whether more or less color is necessary. after a while, you get the feel for it and can usually get it on the first try. you can also use hue/saturation layer and selectively lighten specific color ranges (sometimes removing them completely)